The Retail Leader's Roadmap with Brian Librach

[00:00:06] You're listening to Retail Disrupted, a podcast that explores the latest industry

[00:00:11] developments and the trends that will shape how we shop in the future.

[00:00:16] I'm your host, Natalie Berg.

[00:00:19] I am thrilled to have Brian LeBrock joining me on the podcast today.

[00:00:34] Brian started his career in retail at just 21 years old and quickly worked up the ranks

[00:00:39] to become Vice President of Stores for Urban Outfitters.

[00:00:43] Since then, he's also served as Vice President of Stores and Operations at Pacific Sunware.

[00:00:49] And most recently, he ran Stores internationally for Old Navy.

[00:00:54] Brian is passionate about helping retail teams to improve their performance and he has

[00:00:58] a new book out on this very topic.

[00:01:01] It's called the Retail Leaders Roadmap.

[00:01:04] Take control of your career, unlock your potential and drive toward retail leadership success.

[00:01:10] Now, we're going to welcome Brian onto the podcast in just a minute.

[00:01:14] But before we do that, I wanted to let you know about a live webinar that I'm hosting next

[00:01:18] week.

[00:01:19] It's a rethink retail webinar with the retail technology company, Deepold Nickstorf.

[00:01:25] We're going to be talking about retail mobility and how brands are embracing this technology

[00:01:30] not only to elevate the customer experience, but also to solve problems, things like

[00:01:35] addressing the workforce shortage or improving productivity.

[00:01:39] So we're going to be looking at mobile self-scanning trends.

[00:01:42] We're going to talk about some of the challenges, things like retail theft.

[00:01:46] That's a hot topic as we all know.

[00:01:49] And we're also going to be looking at the opportunities and where we see things moving

[00:01:52] in the future.

[00:01:53] So things like direct payment, for example, as in you won't even need to visit a dedicated

[00:02:00] tail in the future, but we'll be making payments within the device.

[00:02:06] Because like real-time personalization, that is very much the direction to travel.

[00:02:10] And also, you know, maybe using these devices to help retailers become more transparent

[00:02:15] with their ESG data.

[00:02:17] So there are a lot of opportunities.

[00:02:18] There's a lot of different aspects for us to explore.

[00:02:21] I think it's going to be a great conversation.

[00:02:23] It's a free webinar and we want it to be interactive.

[00:02:27] So if you want to join us and get involved in the conversation, the webinar is going

[00:02:32] to be on Tuesday, May 28th at 3 p.m. UK time or 10 a.m. Eastern time if you're in the

[00:02:39] US.

[00:02:40] I'll include the registration link in the show notes or you can head over to the Rethink

[00:02:44] retail website for more information.

[00:02:47] Okay, without further ado, let's get on to our main conversation today and welcome Brian

[00:02:53] LeBrock to the podcast.

[00:03:00] Brian, it's so great to connect with you and have you on the podcast today.

[00:03:04] You have been all over my LinkedIn feed over the past few weeks.

[00:03:07] So it's great to get you on the show and hear firsthand about your new book, about your

[00:03:14] retail experience and also to get your general observations on what's happening in the industry.

[00:03:20] So we have a lot to get into.

[00:03:23] But first tell us a little bit more about you and your background in retail.

[00:03:27] Yeah, Natalie.

[00:03:28] Thanks for having me on as well.

[00:03:29] I'm excited.

[00:03:30] Yeah, so I'm 35 years in the business.

[00:03:32] 3.5 decades, you know, I started at the age of 12 years old working paying taxes in the US,

[00:03:37] which I shouldn't have been able to do.

[00:03:39] But I did and been doing it ever since.

[00:03:42] You know, my father was a retailer.

[00:03:43] My grandfather was a retailer.

[00:03:44] So it's it's lineage.

[00:03:46] It's in my DNA.

[00:03:47] It wasn't an accidental career choice.

[00:03:49] I knew what was what I was going to do and I had a clear roadmap.

[00:03:54] You know, and that's why I wrote this book 35 years later is because I don't believe

[00:03:57] the roadmap exists in the way that it did for me 35 years ago because I knew exactly how

[00:04:01] to get where I needed to get to based on my father and based on my grandfather.

[00:04:04] So that's what this book is about.

[00:04:06] Retail lose roadmap is a way for me to share those three and a half decades and

[00:04:11] you know, make sure that it's very relatable for folks so the people can realize what

[00:04:15] their potential is and get to where they want to get to.

[00:04:18] So let's talk some more about your book.

[00:04:20] The first thing I want to say, Brian, is congratulations because I know it is no easy

[00:04:25] feat to write a book, right?

[00:04:27] So yeah, congratulations.

[00:04:29] It's a labor love for many of us that have fit for in books and I hope that you're

[00:04:34] taken some time to celebrate the launch and all the hard work that I'm sure it took

[00:04:38] to get you to this point.

[00:04:39] So congrats.

[00:04:40] Thank you very much.

[00:04:41] So let's talk a little bit more about the book.

[00:04:43] What led you to write the book and what do you want the industry to take away from

[00:04:47] it?

[00:04:48] Well, I mean, I've been in the business like I said three and a half decades and things

[00:04:51] have changed, right?

[00:04:52] Evolution things have evolved and the generalist in a lot of cases has a lot more on their

[00:04:58] plate than they once used to have and a lot less support.

[00:05:01] And so I believe that maybe 20% of leaders out there take the time to actually invest

[00:05:06] in people and that's not a good number.

[00:05:08] Some cases it's because they don't care but a lot of cases it's because the scope is

[00:05:12] gotten so big that they're just doing the best that they can to keep their heads above

[00:05:15] water.

[00:05:16] And so I believe that the employee, whether you're a specialist or a generalist or a leader,

[00:05:22] now is a bit more of an independent contractor.

[00:05:24] It's the loyalties that used to exist don't exist anymore.

[00:05:28] And so an independent contractor has to build their own brand and they have to learn and

[00:05:32] develop the skill sets themselves and they have to use resources to be able to do that

[00:05:37] mentors.

[00:05:38] They have to follow the right people and they have to use internet whatever it might

[00:05:41] be that's going to help them get what they need.

[00:05:43] And so that's what this book is meant to do.

[00:05:45] It's a way for me to hopefully not hopefully it's a way for me to positively impact

[00:05:49] more people than I could working for one organization, whether that was Gap Ink or whether

[00:05:54] that was Urban Outfit or Pack Sun.

[00:05:56] And like what we're doing here, impact folks in multiple different countries.

[00:06:00] And I believe that anybody who reads this book, cover to cover will understand what it takes

[00:06:06] and then use this book as a diagnostic tool when they're struggling to get on stuck.

[00:06:11] I believe the information is in there and over the next few years as new information becomes

[00:06:16] available, we'll update it to make sure that it's current as well.

[00:06:20] Right.

[00:06:20] And I want to ask you specifically about upscaling.

[00:06:23] Do you think retailers today are doing enough to invest in their staff both in terms of

[00:06:28] kind of general training but also in terms of investing in digital competencies?

[00:06:33] No, I don't.

[00:06:34] I don't.

[00:06:34] I think, you know, my wife and I run a company called The Well Wish or Company and we

[00:06:39] like to refer to ourselves as we're in the people productivity business and there's no

[00:06:43] conversation about people productivity.

[00:06:44] It's all about gender, AI.

[00:06:46] It's all about tools.

[00:06:47] It's all about resources.

[00:06:48] It's finding ways to do more with less.

[00:06:50] Again, I'm an operator.

[00:06:52] I completely get it and I think it's going to help because I think what's going to happen is

[00:06:56] as these tools evolve, the small minor things that people are spending a ton of time on.

[00:07:01] They won't have to anymore and they can really lean into solving problems but people aren't

[00:07:06] paying attention to the productivity that simply people being engaged can deliver.

[00:07:11] And I believe people are given 60% right now, maybe 70%.

[00:07:14] It's not because they're not working harder than not trying.

[00:07:18] They're just not emotionally connected to the work any longer in most cases and so they're

[00:07:22] rationally committed to the work.

[00:07:24] They get a paycheck and they give the very best that they can at the time but they're just

[00:07:28] not embracing it the way that they need to.

[00:07:31] So to me, it's about finding a way to engage people and teach them the technology that's

[00:07:38] needed because obviously we're all going to have to continue to learn more about that.

[00:07:41] But spending time on really knowing how to communicate with folks and how to influence folks

[00:07:45] to be the very best that they can be.

[00:07:46] I think that's going to be a game changer and that's what I'm sitting out to try to

[00:07:50] influence the best that I can.

[00:07:53] Now, why think one of the brilliant and probably very unique things about this industry

[00:07:58] is that you can legitimately start out on the shop floor, stocking shelves.

[00:08:02] And then with enough hard work and determination, you can go on to become CEO of a business.

[00:08:07] And I think that is pretty special about retail.

[00:08:10] But as you say, retail has become less attractive as a career option and it is a problem

[00:08:15] for the industry.

[00:08:17] So I think retailers are having to work really hard to attract and retain talent.

[00:08:21] And I'm curious to know, maybe you've addressed it in the book or maybe you just have some thoughts

[00:08:25] on it more generally, but aside from financial incentives, which is a good place to start.

[00:08:31] How else can you ensure that you got a motivated workforce?

[00:08:35] Is it granting more flexibility?

[00:08:38] Is it giving store managers or staff the autonomy to make decisions at the local level?

[00:08:45] Is it about being rewarded in different ways?

[00:08:48] What can you do to ensure that your staff are feeling empowered and engaged?

[00:08:52] Yeah, I think everything you just mentioned is important.

[00:08:54] I think pay is of course important, but it's never the main reason why people leave jobs in every survey you take.

[00:09:00] You hear that?

[00:09:01] The number one reason I think and what I notice in every survey that I've ever been a part of is it's their leader.

[00:09:07] If you're leading well and you're observing and you're paying attention and you're giving feedback.

[00:09:12] If people are growing, they're going to be engaged.

[00:09:16] And to grow people, it's not easy.

[00:09:19] If it was easy, everybody would be doing it.

[00:09:21] You have to pay attention, you have to observe, you have to get out of the office.

[00:09:24] You have to be in front of people.

[00:09:26] You have to witness what they're doing so that you can give them examples of what they are doing well

[00:09:30] so that they do more of it or examples of what they're not doing well so that they can course correct it.

[00:09:35] But that's not happening at the rate that it should be.

[00:09:38] From what I can tell, people have followed me when they're growing, when they're developing

[00:09:43] and they feel like they're doing their very best work.

[00:09:47] And I know that that's who I've worked for, like when I'm developing it, when I'm growing.

[00:09:51] So to me, that's the key. Yes, flexibility is important.

[00:09:54] You know, letting people make sure people own the business.

[00:09:57] You know, the whole conversation around Gen Z and Gen Alpha is they need to feel like they have a hand in the way the company operates.

[00:10:03] So I think all of those things are important.

[00:10:06] But at its core, people need to be present.

[00:10:09] Leaders need to be present and they need to be paying attention and they need to be able to

[00:10:12] in the book I talk about, like see it say it, both positive and negative.

[00:10:16] And negatives, maybe I shouldn't say negative. Criticism or corrective criticisms,

[00:10:21] they have to be willing to be on the floor whether that be walking around the office and talking to folks.

[00:10:26] Now, that's a whole nother challenge because nobody's back at the office either.

[00:10:30] But I think the new way that we're operating today is going to require people to think differently about how they can observe and get feedback.

[00:10:37] That's so interesting. You've touched on a lot of points that I want to come back to,

[00:10:41] including this idea of execs on the shop floor and getting closer to customers and experiencing what they experience.

[00:10:48] And all that's what we are going to come back to that.

[00:10:50] I want to touch on something that you mentioned,

[00:10:53] though, which you sort of alluded to, this idea of squiggly careers,

[00:10:57] which I have had a squiggly career.

[00:11:00] You know, I worked really hard in my 20s and 30s.

[00:11:02] I then very predictably had a baby, took some time off in the UK.

[00:11:07] You get a whole year off, so I took a lot of time off.

[00:11:10] And then kind of came back to work and tried to work part-time

[00:11:14] and then have one day a week writing a book, I was writing my Amazon book

[00:11:18] and then have one other day a week, so we're at a third day now.

[00:11:21] And then on Fridays, I had a day off to be with my son.

[00:11:25] Now, I wasn't doing anything particularly well when I was trying to do all of those things

[00:11:30] and it actually brings up an important point. So I want to come back to focus and how it relates to retail

[00:11:35] in a little bit, but I guess just this idea of squiggly careers.

[00:11:39] I know you've been very open about making lateral moves throughout your career

[00:11:43] and even accepting emotions in order to ultimately get ahead.

[00:11:47] So can you talk us through this and what you've learned along the way?

[00:11:51] Yeah, I mean, the biggest, the one-demotion I took,

[00:11:54] I took a huge pay cut and went from running 100 stores to run an eight stores,

[00:11:58] I think, and moved 3,000 miles away, but it was because it was for a company

[00:12:01] that I wanted to work for and a person that I wanted to work for.

[00:12:03] And I had confidence that if I, if I basically did the pillars that are in this book,

[00:12:08] I knew I'd be right back where I needed to be in a relatively short period of time.

[00:12:11] It thankfully I was. But the whole idea of like, you know, talk about like focus and whatever it might be,

[00:12:18] you know, whatever you're doing at that present moment and I know that's kind of a kitschy phrase.

[00:12:22] You have to give it its attention. So even like you just mentioned,

[00:12:25] if Thursdays all about your son then you have to put the phone away and that's it.

[00:12:28] I'd be phenomenal at Thursday with your son and be phenomenal at Friday with whatever that might be.

[00:12:34] I found that to be the way that I can prioritize. I talk a lot about prioritization in the book,

[00:12:39] because people have a hard time doing it because if you prioritize something,

[00:12:43] you have to depriorize something and that's what people don't want to do.

[00:12:47] So when I decided to make the change or take the emotion or take the ladder removed,

[00:12:53] I had to feel confident that I would do the work necessary to get back to and then further along.

[00:13:00] And put my ego and check my ego with the door, which is not an easy thing to do.

[00:13:06] But what I'm finding at least in the industry today, so many more people are

[00:13:11] taking positions that are in a later lateral or completely different within retail.

[00:13:16] Right? Go from operations to be an allocator to being back in the field, whatever that might be.

[00:13:21] And that spider webbing, if you will, helps them because ultimately they're taking in all these inputs.

[00:13:25] And they're going to have a more broad skill set.

[00:13:28] Interesting. I want to talk about culture and this idea of bringing your people with you.

[00:13:33] And obviously we're in a period of profound structural change.

[00:13:37] And I feel like I've been using that phrase for at least 10 years now. But it's true, right?

[00:13:41] There's just so much change in this section.

[00:13:43] Now earlier this year, I chaired the tech and digital stage at retail week live.

[00:13:48] This is one of the biggest retail events on this side of the pond.

[00:13:53] And one of our speakers was Ben Fletcher, who is the CFO of the very group,

[00:13:59] which is a big online fashion retailer.

[00:14:01] And he talked about their digital transformation journey and all of the tangible metrics that that entailed.

[00:14:09] But he said that the hardest thing was actually the cultural shift because it's so tricky to measure.

[00:14:16] It takes longer, but it's so critical to get your people on board.

[00:14:21] So I'm curious, I'm curious Brian, what's your experience Ben Lake?

[00:14:26] Or what are some kind of general observations that you might have

[00:14:30] having been part of large retail organizations during this period of so much disruption?

[00:14:36] What have you observed in terms of cultural shifts?

[00:14:39] Yeah, yeah. I think the catch phrase for quite a few years was change management.

[00:14:45] I keep hearing it and I think that is what's happening right with the cultural shifts.

[00:14:49] I think two things have to be prevalent. There has to be trust,

[00:14:53] and there has to be an openness to learn.

[00:14:55] And when you have an openness to learn, you're willing to try out new things.

[00:15:01] And that's what a new culture is. It's operating differently.

[00:15:04] And if you trust your leaders, so if you trust the company, then you trust that it's going to work out.

[00:15:10] And if it doesn't work out, you trust that they'll shift. But when you don't trust your boss,

[00:15:14] and you don't trust the company, you're not going to change. You're not going to be open to it.

[00:15:18] And if you're not open in general, you're not curious, obviously even if you trust people,

[00:15:22] you're not going to be open to what new changes is coming about.

[00:15:26] I joked earlier about the conversation for a lot of years.

[00:15:29] My father says it, his father said it like this younger generation, right?

[00:15:32] Like it's like no, it's evolution. Every generation has been fine, right?

[00:15:35] They've all found their way. But I think people get stuck, and they get in this,

[00:15:40] they get in their head, and their ego's getting away. And what I'm finding with smaller organizations is

[00:15:46] obviously it's easier for them because they have 5, 10, 15 or 20 stores, or they're just starting out with brick and mortar,

[00:15:51] and they've been doing it online only. And there's a lot of those companies that are starting out that I think

[00:15:57] are going to be the most nimble. It's the big companies that have 50,000 employees

[00:16:03] and 1,000 stores or 500 stores that are going to have the harder time because they've got a much

[00:16:08] bigger ship to turn around. And that is going to take more time. And trust isn't paramount right now

[00:16:16] in organizations and leaders don't have the time to connect the way that they really should.

[00:16:21] So that's what I think is making it a big challenge today for the bigger companies.

[00:16:25] I think a lot of the smaller companies are going to win because they're going to have the ability to be nimble.

[00:16:30] Yeah, just that little bit more agile than some of the the big retail super tankers.

[00:16:34] Now Brian, you ran store operations for a number of big US retailers. Do you think that the

[00:16:40] industry's perception of bricks and mortar has evolved in recent years? And also I guess as a follow-up

[00:16:46] to that what more do you think can be done to ensure that physical stores stay relevant for shoppers today?

[00:16:52] Yeah, I mean, obviously COVID created a very different environment and obviously online

[00:17:00] was you know the online business was projected a continue to grow and then with COVID it

[00:17:03] obviously skyrocketed and then kind of settled down a little bit now all the sudden brick and

[00:17:07] mortar matters again. You know it's one of those things where in retail I find that people swing the

[00:17:12] pendulum so harsh in one way or the other. So it's all about online or it's all about brick and mortar.

[00:17:16] It's never like 51 49%. And that's the reality of where it should be. Whether it's 6040 or 7030

[00:17:23] but there's a blend and I've yet to see a company do really good, do a really good job at making

[00:17:29] it all work and everybody get along and play on the same team right? There's the online team and

[00:17:33] there's the brick and mortar team and with ship from store and all these different incentives

[00:17:38] out there that store teams have to do to help support online and vice versa. That's the challenge.

[00:17:43] And I think the companies that can figure out how to make it feel like your one team,

[00:17:48] those are the ones that I think are going to win. And that's also I think the smaller teams

[00:17:51] are going to have a better chance at it because they're smaller and they're more nimble and they

[00:17:54] get to again interact and engage I think more effectively. But brick and mortar is going to

[00:17:59] it's going to matter you know in a lot of cases it's more of a showroom. You know I remember years ago

[00:18:05] when I was urban alpha leaders we closed the store and met Hatton and we saw our online business

[00:18:10] dropped dramatically within that zip code because we no longer had a showroom.

[00:18:14] So although we might have been losing money in that location, we ended up losing more money

[00:18:19] because we shut it down and we lost the customer that was going online in that area.

[00:18:22] So there's this understanding of the balance of its importance. In some cases it's going to drive

[00:18:26] ROI and put money on the you know it's going to put money in the bank. In other cases it's going to be

[00:18:30] a marketing tool that you have to pay attention to from the online side of things. So it's the relationship

[00:18:36] between the two that matters. Yeah it's that all kind of elusive halo effect right where having a physical

[00:18:42] presence actually does drive online sales. It's counter intuitive as I might sound. It's a

[00:18:47] video so interesting and now you know the new industry buzzword is unified commerce we've sort

[00:18:53] of gone from multi channel to omnichannel to unify commerce and I think it's you know as an analyst

[00:18:59] it's just so fascinating seeing how it's evolved and at the end of the day I guess it is just

[00:19:03] shopping right it's just that it's getting easier and more relevant, more seamless, more personalized.

[00:19:07] So as retailers you know a lot of hard work happening in the in the background to deliver that

[00:19:12] that seamless experience but um right let's continue with the theme of stores and I want to ask you

[00:19:20] about how we measure how we measure success in a physical store setting because we think about

[00:19:27] traditional KPIs things like same store sales growth sales densities you know we know that these

[00:19:33] traditional metrics are just no longer relevant they don't reflect the way that we shop.

[00:19:38] As we just said today we shop on our terms we might not go into a store to buy something but we might

[00:19:43] go in because we want that showroom experience who want to touch and feel the product or try it on

[00:19:48] or talk to a member of staff, et cetera so I'd love to know how do you think we should be

[00:19:54] measuring a store success today do you think we should be looking at things like staff satisfaction

[00:20:01] customer 12 time what percentage of online orders are collected or returned in store so I love to

[00:20:08] get your thoughts around this and and I guess it's sort of reflective of how we're seeing the overall

[00:20:13] role of the store evolving as well so over to you Brian what do you think?

[00:20:18] Yeah you know it's interesting because I remember what quite a few years ago when I was with

[00:20:23] Gapink there was an attempt to incentivize folks based on purchases being done within the zip code for

[00:20:30] example so it wasn't you weren't just incentive on whether they purchase in your store you were

[00:20:33] incentive on whether or not they went home jumped online and bought something because maybe they

[00:20:37] experienced something in the store and so it just it didn't work in the way that it was very difficult

[00:20:42] to track you know and teams really didn't know whether or not it was working and so you know in

[00:20:47] retail we tend to be I like it to we have a need for instant gratification most people that have chosen

[00:20:53] this profession especially those that are in stores and so the challenge of the way that we

[00:20:58] probably need to incent folks is that it's not immediate and it takes some time to really understand

[00:21:04] its impact you know dollar per square foot's always been a favorite one of mine but to your point

[00:21:09] you know the nowadays that's not necessarily the case because there has to be an understanding of

[00:21:13] the online component you know yeah there has to be and so at the end of the day if the store

[00:21:19] or the zip code or the area code we had where we want to look at it if this if there's

[00:21:23] if money is not making it into the bank that's going to be the problem and profitability is not

[00:21:28] talked about in a lot of cases at the store level and some companies do a really good job

[00:21:32] of making sure that store leaders understand the profitability of their store and some companies don't

[00:21:37] even want the regional directors to pay attention to it because they feel like all they should

[00:21:41] be doing is executing but at the end of the day the profitability of a space is paramount

[00:21:48] because if you can't pay the bills and you can't pay the mortgage or the rent and then you can't

[00:21:52] you can't run the business so I think it's about teaching people how to be business owners

[00:21:57] but even that it's tough because you may lose money in your store but yet it's still benefits

[00:22:01] the company because of the online side of things and so how do you share that information as well

[00:22:05] and that's where I think that relationship again is so critical and I don't know that I've seen

[00:22:09] many people figure it out okay so let's shift gears a little bit and talk about winning retailers

[00:22:15] retail is incredibly bifurcated right now there is this growing disparity between the winners and

[00:22:20] the losers but some retailers just keep getting it right and are thriving despite all of this disruption

[00:22:27] are there any retailers or brands out there that you admire Brian and what is it that they're

[00:22:34] getting right? Yeah it's interesting because I personally like the shop on Abbeckany and Venice Beach

[00:22:38] or you know, Asington and Toronto so like those are the types of streets I like to shop

[00:22:42] and it's a lot more smaller you know in a lot of cases what was considered DTC companies or

[00:22:47] things that nature but like Viori is a good example of a company that I enjoy. I was on Abbeckany

[00:22:52] a couple months back and they were the busiest store on the block and I mean busy by 10 times

[00:22:57] everybody else and so there's this bit of this like atleast not at leisure so much for me but

[00:23:03] it is comfort but fashion at the same time I think has been huge. Farty is another company that's

[00:23:08] kind of I think they have 25 or 30 stores in the US and they're starting to expand outside of the

[00:23:12] US again the quality of the product is really top notch but the experience you know the experience

[00:23:18] online is great the experience and the store is great the employees are engaging you know they have

[00:23:24] a staff that's the other thing like if I walk into a Farty or Viori there's a staff

[00:23:29] and I don't know how they're covering the payroll but there's a staff and hopefully they are

[00:23:33] so they stay in business but it feels good to have that level of engagement whereas most retailers

[00:23:38] I walk into today the tables are disheveled because there's nobody there to maintain it as well

[00:23:43] let alone right interact or engage with you when you're in the fitting room so I think it's this

[00:23:47] interesting balance of you know if you have the right product you could price it right so your margins

[00:23:52] are good you can have payroll to be able to take care of your customer. The flip side is the value players

[00:23:58] are still doing exceptionally well in the US right the dollar store TJ Maxx Ross that they're doing

[00:24:04] exceptionally well um again obviously given the economy there's there's there's an interest in folks

[00:24:09] having you know the disposable income for other things but yeah for me I'm inspired by those

[00:24:16] smaller companies that have found a way to create amazing product drive really good margin and

[00:24:21] creative great experience in store. Yeah and I think that just shows that the you know the

[00:24:26] fundamentals of retail actually haven't changed at all you still need to have a good product you

[00:24:31] still need to offer a good experience or good service and I would argue you probably it's probably

[00:24:35] even more of a need to do that now in this digital era where we can just get anything we want online so

[00:24:41] if we're going to come into a store you really got to give someone an experience and that I

[00:24:45] hope this whole idea of like mediocre service I mean customers just don't tolerate it anymore

[00:24:50] and it just takes one mad experience so yeah really really interesting examples that you call

[00:24:54] out there I'd like to stick with the theme of winning retailers and I'm gonna just gonna share

[00:25:02] what I think are four key traits of successful retailers and I'd love to get your reaction Brian

[00:25:07] and here and feel free to disagree a little bit debate so we should get on the podcast.

[00:25:12] So I think we think about successful retailers we've already touched on this this idea of focus right

[00:25:17] this idea that you have to know what you stand for, have a clear identity,

[00:25:22] differentiate in what it is an incredibly crowded market and then you have to exit really well.

[00:25:28] I think the second thing is having a culture of perpetual innovation so this idea that you can never

[00:25:34] stand still in retail that you've got to keep moving the agile Amazon I think you know is a great

[00:25:41] example of a retailer that is relentlessly dissatisfied with the status quo and interesting we're

[00:25:48] actually starting to hear at least here in Europe we're starting to hear more mainstream retailers

[00:25:54] taking on that mentality so MNS you know big clothing and food retailer here in the UK they

[00:26:00] now talk of being positively dissatisfied as it's a word the phrase rather that they're CEO users

[00:26:06] so really interesting to see that shift. The third thing for me customer centricity it's a

[00:26:13] it's a broad kind of fluffy term but I think a lot of retailers think that their customer

[00:26:19] centric but actually aren't always so customer centric but yes yeah just this idea that you

[00:26:27] start with the customer and then you work backwards there's no ivory towers you know more and

[00:26:32] more we're starting to see retailers requiring their head office staff to spend time in stores

[00:26:39] car for and Spain and more since in the UK are actually bringing customers into their management meetings

[00:26:45] and the CEO of car for his bonus is partially indexed to its NPS score so really really interesting

[00:26:54] stuff happening and then very briefly the last thing and I think you'll agree with this one is that

[00:26:59] happy staff equals happy customers so adopting this employee first mentality and again just to kind of

[00:27:06] reiterate this idea that shoppers don't tolerate mediocre service or mediocre experiences so

[00:27:12] that's kind of my like when I'm out talking to clients are giving presentations that that's my

[00:27:17] framework that's what I think retailers need to be striving for but what do you think Brian I'd

[00:27:21] love to get your take especially around the kind of happy staff equals happy customers to it

[00:27:26] yeah yeah I just made I wrote all those downs so I have the notes I think what's interesting

[00:27:29] about the focus and execution part of the conversation that you had is I think it's I think price

[00:27:34] I think price is extremely important and people understanding where they need to be and I feel like

[00:27:39] you either at least for when I can tell in the US you're either higher low and that you know and

[00:27:43] it's a bit I hate to say but it's also class in general like the middle class you know doesn't

[00:27:47] exist anymore you're either you either wealthier you're not wealthy and then that's the saturday

[00:27:50] ality of what we hear about I think pricing is similar you know you can't be in the middle

[00:27:56] your value player in my opinion or your catering to somebody who has more disposable income

[00:28:01] and how do you stick with your lane so that you build your reputation right and then I use

[00:28:06] viory or fardy as an example I don't ever see them on sale like their their price regular price

[00:28:11] and that the great quality and yet then there's the dollar store or tgmax where you know you're

[00:28:16] going to get value so I think the folks that win with focus and attention win with the right pricing

[00:28:21] strategy. I think the innovation for me I think it's fun to talk about it in stores but I think

[00:28:28] it's a lot more important to talk about when it comes to distribution and supply chain and

[00:28:32] the channels behind the scenes they get product to you faster and more efficiently so that the

[00:28:37] store teams districts regions whatever their job is easier because of how things happen behind

[00:28:44] so they can actually engage and spend all their time and energy on the customer. So I think it's

[00:28:49] tricky but I think companies have to really understand where to invest in innovation and I don't know

[00:28:55] that a mirror that tells me if I look appropriate or not and I could buy that I don't know that

[00:29:00] that's going to do much for the industry for quite some time but I do know that if you can get the

[00:29:05] product delivered in such a way that it's already folded and it's there first before everybody else

[00:29:10] and it's easy to process that's going to help tremendously so I think those companies that are doing

[00:29:16] that super important and then you're coming about customer centric and then happy staff to me

[00:29:19] it's the same thing. I agree with you we think we're customer centric but we're not listening

[00:29:25] to the customer right product is being created because folks are listening to and reading the

[00:29:30] comments in social media and recognizing that people are asking for something in blue but it's only

[00:29:35] provided in black they make it in blue because the customer is so customer centric isn't just

[00:29:40] about what's happening in a brick and mortar space it really are you listening to what the

[00:29:44] customer is saying and by the way now more than ever customers telling you on social media through

[00:29:49] comments what it is that they like and don't like so it's about whether or not the whole industry

[00:29:54] is curious enough to be customer centric and then the happy staff I completely agree and that is where

[00:30:00] I think you're going to have a greater focus you're going to have better innovation right you're

[00:30:05] going to be more customer centric if you have a staff that is engaged if you have no if your

[00:30:10] staff is not engaged your innovation's going to be okay right like your customer centric approach

[00:30:16] is going to be just okay so that's why you have to start with people and the companies and teams

[00:30:23] so all the companies it have teams that are engaged with the ones that are going to win.

[00:30:30] Thank you for listening to retail disrupted if you enjoyed this episode and would like to support

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